HORNS on the Opry, Why all the silence?

Jerry Bruner · Post by **Jerry Bruner** » 6 Aug 2001 6:46 pm

Personally, I THOROUGHLY enjoyed Dale Watson's performance on the Opry, and I agree that Mr. RICKY DAVIS was AWESOME and he looked like he was REALLY ENJOYING it.

However I am partially amused and partially disgusted with the SGF as the silence is deafening. The "hardliner traditionalists" moaned and groaned when there was SLIDE GUITAR on the Opry, but their voices are totally SILENT about HORNS. Now I do not think horns are country instruments at all (although they do make their way onto hits like "Ring of Fire" for instance) but horns ARE a part of its cousin WESTERN SWING. Now since Watson is a Texan and I guess Texas is probably the state where western swing flourishes the most.... then it's really not out of place on a Watson record. And this was a treat as I don't think he tours with a horn section or a piano in his band!! (As long as he has RICKY in his band I'll be happy)

But I just felt the need to sound off because of all the "IT AIN'T COUNTRY" that was hollered at the slide guitar, yet deafening silence about the horns. I bet you if Reba played the Opry (fat chance) and brought a sax player there you could hear the hollering ad nauseum, but if Merle brought a sax player (does he stil have one in his band?).......... not a word would be uttered.

I just hope we don't have to wait years before another Watson appearance on the televised portion again.

Go Ricky.... Go Ricky.... Go Ricky.....

Earl Erb · Post by **Earl Erb** » 6 Aug 2001 8:12 pm

Seems to me if my memory serves me,Marty Robbins beat em' all to the punch in the horn department.When Marty started performing "Carmen" on the Opry in the early 70's Roy Acuff blew his top when Marty showed up with a brass section.Bill Anderson has performed the Opry with horns in the past.I played the Opry from 1968 to 1976 and I remember when the drummers finally got to sit behind a full set of drums around 1971.Roy fought that for years saying country music was a snare drum and high hat.The staff drummer was Harold Weakly and thats all he could play.Roy finally gave into the pressure of changing times.My point is that I was there when it started and I'm not bothered by horns now.

Skeeter Davis-1968-69,Jim Ed Brown-1970-76[This message was edited by Earl Erb on 06 August 2001 at 09:15 PM.]

Jody Sanders · Post by **Jody Sanders** » 6 Aug 2001 8:51 pm

Two of the best country-western swing bands that I ever worked with had horn players. Butch Keith was a great trumpet and Vernon Drozd was a great sax player. I worked a gig with Gene Watson with a horn player. Gene had a top ten song that had a horn player on the record. The lead player played trumpet on that one song. Jody.

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 7 Aug 2001 2:58 am

"slide" it out of here

Joey Ace · Post by **Joey Ace** » 7 Aug 2001 4:03 am

I forgot about those trombones until you mentioned it. I was so impressed by Ricky and Dale. They did not get in the way so I guess they were good.

Maybe somewhere there's a Trombone Forum that is raving about these guys.

They fit the music. I have no problem with them. I also enjoyed Leroy's Slide Guitar a few weeks ago.

-j0e-

Geoff Brown · Post by **Geoff Brown** » 7 Aug 2001 5:36 am

Earl, those are great stories and facts you mentioned in your post. I'll bet you have a lot of 'em

Earl Erb · Post by **Earl Erb** » 7 Aug 2001 6:21 am

Hello Geoff,I have a few but it takes something like this to get the memory bank going.

Leigh Howell · Post by **Leigh Howell** » 7 Aug 2001 6:42 am

Slide Guitar, and Brass, is like comparing apples, and oranges!! :
Leigh

http://leecountry.s5.com

Ray Jenkins · Post by **Ray Jenkins** » 7 Aug 2001 7:15 am

Come on Earl,more stories. I'm serious,we really do want to hear them.
Ray

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Steeling is still legal in Arizona

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 7 Aug 2001 7:34 am

Hmmmnnn....I'm trying to remember, what was it that "Boots" Randolph played?

Earl Erb · Post by **Earl Erb** » 7 Aug 2001 10:02 am

SAX! and that's my final answer.We're talking about the Opry and Boots was never a member of the Opry.As a matter of fact,I can't remember him ever being invited to perform on the Opry.
Ray...I don't know if I can tell that one.

BTW. Ray,where in the heck is Mark? I haven't seen him on line in months.

[This message was edited by Earl Erb on 07 August 2001 at 11:58 AM.]

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 7 Aug 2001 12:34 pm

Lawrence Welk had a steel guitar, so I guess it's OK for the Opry to have horns!

And another thing...
I have nothing against "slide guitar", but does everybody have to play it with distortion and overdrive? Come to think of it...that's a good question. Why does slide guitar always have to be so "fuzzed-up"?[This message was edited by Donny Hinson on 07 August 2001 at 01:41 PM.]

Earl Erb · Post by **Earl Erb** » 7 Aug 2001 12:50 pm

Two reasons Donny,
1.Covers up bad technique.
2.Don't want to sound like Cousin' Jody.

Theresa Galbraith · Post by **Theresa Galbraith** » 7 Aug 2001 2:01 pm

I don't think it covers up bad technique at all. It adds another flavor to pick from and hopefully, someone will like it and want to buy one. I believe musicians learn from other instruments. Theresa[This message was edited by Theresa Galbraith on 07 August 2001 at 03:02 PM.]

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 7 Aug 2001 2:10 pm

Is Ray Price Country? He had horns all the time I played with him,and drums, and piano, and a hard jazz guitarest,AND vibraphone!(and me!). We did the instrumental, " BLUE EMMONS" and steel was written totally out!I had to sit there and listen to horns and strings play my steel guitar instrumental!Sorry, but he wasn't very country in '69 -----79. I went to work with Dean Martin during this period and that was more country than Price was. BUT, I really did love the music Ray did and I loved the band,BIG BIG BIG! I even worked with Robert Mitchem for a little while,"Little Ole Wine drinker Me", but I'm sure no one remembers this. Horns don't make or break country music is what I'm trying to say,STEEL DOES!
Bobbe [This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 07 August 2001 at 03:22 PM.]

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 7 Aug 2001 2:28 pm

I can't remember ever working in a western swing group that didn't have at least a trumpet and sax!(but of course that wasn't country)[This message was edited by Gene Jones on 07 August 2001 at 03:31 PM.]

Earl Erb · Post by **Earl Erb** » 7 Aug 2001 3:38 pm

Theresa,I guess you have to play guitar to understand what I'm trying to say...I HATE SLIDE GUITAR!

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 7 Aug 2001 6:38 pm

I think Johnny Cash started it all with that "Ring of Fire" song!

Seriously though, I think the Western Swing groups added the horns after swing (a la Dorsey and Goodman) started getting popular. Originally, "Western Swing" groups were a lot more "Western" (cowboy-music) than they were "Swing", weren't they???

Andy Volk · Post by **Andy Volk** » 7 Aug 2001 6:44 pm

I thought the horns were great and added to Dale & Ricky's performance.

Janice Brooks · Post by **Janice Brooks** » 7 Aug 2001 7:25 pm

Donnie I thinks it's the opposete. Bob Wills
had more instaments on the original San Antonio Rose then Glenn Miller had for In the Mood. Just compare the Essentasls on Columbia verses the new MGM collection.

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Janice "Busgal" Brooks
ICQ 44729047

Tim Rowley · Post by **Tim Rowley** » 7 Aug 2001 8:27 pm

If you all will remember, when Bob Wills and the Texas Playboys played the Grand Ole Opry at the Ryman Auditorium following WW II, Opry officials informed him that "there will be no drums nor horns". So Bob told the boys "pack up, we're goin' home". Then the Opry officials backed down and allowed the band to perform with horns and drums. This was the one and only time that Wills and his band played the Opry, and may well have been the very first time horns and drums appeared there. At any rate, some considered it musical heresy, but then again it's common knowledge that Bob Wills NEVER considered his music to be "country", he just played what his fans wanted to hear. Nevertheless Bob Wills was inducted into the Country Music Hall of Fame in 1968, horns notwithstanding. Roy "no horns allowed" Acuff and Tex Ritter announced his induction. That night they referred to Wills as a "folk hero" among other things. Hmmm...

Tim R.

ESnow · Post by **ESnow** » 7 Aug 2001 11:30 pm

I think horns have always really added to Merle's sound. Don Markham plays a sax ride with such great taste and you can listen to Gary Church trombone ride on Twinkle Twinkle Lucky Star. A real good horn player that knows when and where to play can compliment a band.

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 8 Aug 2001 2:54 am

Reference an earlier post....."cowboy" music was what Gene Autry and Roy Rogers did. "Hillbilly" music was what was played on the Opry in those days. Neither was on a western-swing playlist.

John Floyd · Post by **John Floyd** » 8 Aug 2001 3:09 am

The Main reason that No one has complained that the Horns were used in very good taste, Complimented Dales Song. I don't think any instrument should be excluded from the Opry, If it is used in Good Taste and it Fits Musically.

I HATE SLIDE GUITAR!

I'm with Earl on this one.

BTW
Trumpet and a Steel Guitar Blend very well together.

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John

[This message was edited by John Floyd on 08 August 2001 at 04:13 AM.]

John Kavanagh · Post by **John Kavanagh** » 8 Aug 2001 12:11 pm

I guess the short answer is that nobody on this forum would be real upset if it looked like Western Swing was making a comeback.

I really like slide guitar, by the way.